When You Override Consent, The Horror Starts: Obsession

We review Obsession (2026) while drunk and caffeinated, score it category by category, and admit it left us disturbed long after the credits. We use the movie to talk plainly about consent, the “nice guy” villain, and the damage we cause when we manufacture a reality that erases someone else’s autonomy. 
• Quick detour into Celebrity Ghost Stories skepticism 
• Our three-part review method plus what we are drinking 
• Plot recap of the One Wish Willow and the obsession spiral 
• Trigger warning and why the film is a hard watch 
• Acting highlights and standout lead performance 
• Cinematography notes on pace, color, shadows, and demonic movement 
• Score and sound design debate plus nostalgia fatigue 
• Why the protagonist’s cowardice is the engine of horror 
• The Golden Path on red pill culture and learning lessons the hard way 
• Manufactured reality as the core theme plus the vase scene symbolism 
• What we would do differently if we were in the story 
• The bottom line takeaway on accountability and consent

Transcript

Water Filter Fix And Gross Ice

SPEAKER_03 0:00

So remember everyone, after you replace your water filter, you need to run at least four gallons of water through the system.

SPEAKER_01 0:08

Yeah, it's for a lot of filters. It'll tell you on the filter box how many w how many gallons you have to run through it. It's like uh it's like the manufacturing chemicals, and there's like loose carbon in the filter, and it doesn't taste good.

SPEAKER_03 0:24

It's not good for your health. It's got my ice smelling bad. That's that's the issue I'm having with it currently. Gross. So hey everyone. Welcome to High Dry Podcast. I'm your host, Ryan Bear North. With me as always, James Crosslin, and we are the only podcast keeping alive the fandom of celebrity ghost stories from 2009.

Celebrity Ghost Stories And Skepticism

SPEAKER_03 0:48

Celebrity ghost stories. Yeah, yeah. So there was a show where each episode celebrities, and I'm I'm imagining they use that term loosely. Like you remember I love the eighties and I love the seventies and all that?

SPEAKER_01 1:05

Yes, of course I do. That they shaped my humor. Paul F. Tompkins, hilarious. Michael Ian Black, just man, really shaped my humor for sure.

SPEAKER_03 1:16

But celebrities. Well, so I'm looking, so I guess at one point Marilyn Manson had a story on there. Oh, really? McKelty Williamson says he got a call from his dead friend that he thought was in hell. Shit.

SPEAKER_01 1:33

I mean, he maybe he was right. Jim Norman. Who's Jim Norman? Regis Philbin?

SPEAKER_02 1:40

Who's Regis? No, just kidding.

SPEAKER_03 1:42

Uh yeah, well, there you go. So that was a thing. That was a thing that we did in 2009.

SPEAKER_01 1:51

Fun celebrity ghost stories. But uh and and nobody's nobody's willing to tell these people. You know ghosts aren't real, right? The whole story.

SPEAKER_03 2:03

And then hey. You know this ain't real, right? You just you're a liar.

SPEAKER_01 2:09

No, nobody in their lives are like, listen. Listen. Come on, man. You did not get called by a ghost, I promise.

SPEAKER_03 2:16

Like, could could it be your lifestyle of like copient amounts of drugs and you know having just being surrounded by yes men, maybe you started to believe it? I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 2:30

But anyway, I read here that Joan Rivers shared a story about using a voodoo priestess to help her deal with a hostile spirit. Somebody wanted your money, Joan. Yeah, Joan.

SPEAKER_03 2:43

Joan, baby. What are you doing? Well, uh well, we're not actually going to be uh talking about Celebrity Glow Stories 2009. Thank God. We're gonna be talking things that are real today. Um, and personally, I think it's a good thing that two men get to weigh in on it. And I think that's what the world needs right now. So we are actually going to be discussing the film obsession. And we're gonna do that in a three-part

Why Obsession Is Today’s Topic

SPEAKER_03 3:12

method, guaranteed to get you the best results for your podcasting buck. First, we're gonna give you a definitive score out of five stars to let you know um where this film sits. It's indisputable. No one could argue it. It just is what it is. Then we are going to dive into the deeper meanings of this film on the golden path, and finally, we're going to insert ourselves drugs or alcohol into the film. And what makes it so special, so fun, is that we're going to be doing it drunk and/or high. So, James, uh, what are you uh what are you doing this week?

SPEAKER_01 3:44

I am doing iced coffee, and it's delicious. Got some a big big shout out to uh Sown brand, uh oat oat-based

Drinks, Habits, And Whiskey Shelves

SPEAKER_01 3:55

creamer, salted caramel. Fucking awesome. I won't drink, I won't use any other creamer.

unknown 4:03

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 4:03

Alright.

SPEAKER_03 4:04

Well, there you go. Well, I'm gonna be joining you with uh Knob Creek, H9 Years, 100 horsepower. It's my usual. Just had a bottle of it lying around. It costs a lot to do the specialty bottles. And uh just reaches a point where why?

SPEAKER_01 4:22

Because they're good because they're gorgeous.

SPEAKER_03 4:24

They are. I do have uh I have them when I finish one off, I toss it up on like the top of the cabinets in the kitchen. I won't tell you how far I've gotten, but you know. Ron Row 2. A shelf of uh of of whiskey. A shelf. So alright. Well, let's get to it then. So it's time for our first toast, first hit, first slug this week. And it's gonna go to our newest listeners and their fine VPNs, these ones are coming to us from Tapahanock,

Toasts, New Listeners, And Society Rant

SPEAKER_03 5:02

Virginia. Let's see, we got some London Epinac of Sayon et Lor. And then Basil of Basil City. Yeah. And then also not familiar. No, couldn't tell you. No idea where Osaka is. I don't know. Ashburn, Virginia just lights us up, but they always do. Um thanks, Ashburn.

SPEAKER_00 5:24

Yeah, thanks, Ashburn. I assume that's the FBI, Senor Langley? Or is that CI? I'm guessing so.

SPEAKER_03 5:31

I'm guessing so. They're check. Oh no. All right, we had uh we had a list uh so our newest listeners are actually from Israel. Oh, great. Yeah, so FBI and Israel are now patched in. Sweet. Hell yeah. So that's good. Uh welcome to the show. Hope you enjoy. So cheers.

SPEAKER_01 5:57

Let me tell you a little bit about what I think.

SPEAKER_03 6:01

I got some opinions while I have you on the line here. Everything's doing you're doing everything great. Everything's awesome. Stay the cool. Everything's awesome. Yeah, it's just the problem is the people in charge they don't care if shit goes bad. They're so insulated from all of it. Yeah. The entire structure system, everything could just start toppling and they don't give a fuck.

SPEAKER_01 6:28

Yeah, because they still have a massive amount of structural and personal financial power.

SPEAKER_03 6:33

Yeah, so it's like, why the fuck do they care about keeping things together? So well, uh our next host to this one goes out to the uh ever-crumbling state of our society. Cheers. Ooh, that knob is creaking. All right, and finally, uh last host, last hit. This one goes out to our film this week. Obsession.

SPEAKER_01 7:01

Cheers.

SPEAKER_03 7:05

Oh my. So let's jump into it.

SPEAKER_00 7:10

Yeah, yeah, let's jump into it. How do you want to do that? What'd you say? I'll uh I'll I'll start.

SPEAKER_03 7:17

Did you do you uh you want to give a summary? I can do it, sure. Please.

SPEAKER_01 7:22

Okay. So uh so this is a horror movie that it's listed as 2005, I think, because it hit the cert the like uh devil circuit in 2005, but she uh but it just came out, just it was just released uh in uh in May of 2026, the

Plot Summary And The One Wish

SPEAKER_01 7:39

wide theater release. And uh it's a movie about a young man who has an unrequited love for one of his uh woman friends and he and co-worker. And and so he he's like a perennial like uh coward, I'd say, uh afraid, afraid to tell her his feelings because of because it's he's afraid to be vulnerable. And uh and uh he finds a like uh novelty, he in a s in a shop he finds a novelty uh item that's called the One Wish Willow. And you break it and you make a wish, and the wish comes true, and the person behind the counter is like, don't come back complaining if you don't like your wish. It's like very much a monkey paw kind of uh kind of story. And uh he ends up breaking it and say wishing that uh uh this uh woman loved him more than uh anyone else in the world. And from there, uh her personality totally changes. She becomes, as the as the title suggests, obsessed with him. And uh it's a tale of careful what you wish for. She starts to become increasingly more unhinged, and there's like glimpses of when she pops back to reality, when she's not under the spell of of the obsession. Um and it devolves into it's all the like dark sides of of obsession, of of like of being really, really into someone and having and going off the rails and and losing your grip on reality. And he starts to regret his choice, but never backs away from it. He never actually he never except until fine, and we'll talk about this more. Yeah, we'll talk about it at the very end.

SPEAKER_03 9:33

When he finally gets attention from another woman and he's just okay, uh, this is actually what I wanted. I I was just infatuated. Uh oh shit, I'm I'm a piece of shit.

SPEAKER_01 9:41

Yeah. Yeah, we'll we'll get there. Um, but it it evolves into bloody murder and and blurter, yeah. Yeah, it just goes off the rails.

SPEAKER_00 9:52

And um yeah, and so that's the story. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 9:56

Well, so yeah, for me, so uh let me just jump into some scores here. So um I thought overall this was a good film.

SPEAKER_00 10:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 10:05

It was a hard watch. It was a hard watch.

SPEAKER_02 10:07

It was really tough.

SPEAKER_03 10:09

There's there's a lot here about just consent and uh I I think there's a lot here about

Ryan’s Ratings And Trigger Warning

SPEAKER_03 10:16

the the the nice guy, you know. Oh yeah. Um and all that sort of thing. So it's it's a hard watch, and you know, if you know, if you or someone you know is you know dealt with the removal of consent, this might be this might be a difficult one for you, so forewarning.

SPEAKER_01 10:34

Yeah, it's it's an incredibly disturbing movie, even if you like feel capable of dealing with the the uh the concept of consent being violated. It's just like visually and emotionally disturbing. Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 10:52

But uh the acting here, I I saw some really standout acting.

SPEAKER_01 10:56

Oh yeah, I agree.

SPEAKER_03 10:58

So there was some standout acting. Um some of the characters the they were reading their lines, doing their thing, yeah. Which was fine. You know, not everyone is, you know, fucking, you know. Not not everyone can be Andy Richter. That's right. Yeah, Andy Richter really threw me off. And it did. He threw me off. Like, why are you why is Andy Richter here? Yeah, and uh Conan's podcast isn't paying enough, all right? Well, it's just I um you know anyone who listens to the show for half a fucking second knows how anti-nepo I am. And uh honestly, the first thing I did was look into these guys who made it, and I I don't know I don't know just because you have the the director of this, um um Curry Baker. He does tons of internet stuff and he does a lot of like the short films and things like that, and you see him around and he's got funny skits and everything like that, and and the the dickbag friend who wanted a billion dollars, he features in a lot of their films and all that kind of stuff.

SPEAKER_04 12:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 12:06

So you see you see them together a lot. But I click on Curry Baker, his fucking dad has a Wikipedia page, he's a playwright, and like award like, and so I'm like, god damn it, tell me it's not the case, but I but I don't know for sure how far it goes. So I'm trying to keep that out of my head because it that throws me out of a film, but then I'm like, why the fuck is Andy Richter there? Um how do you know Andy Richter? You shouldn't know Andy Richter, no one should know Andy Richter. Conan just out of great, like as some charitable act has been keeping that man. But anyway, um Andy Andy Richter should be anonymous, basically. But I'm like, how what circles are you rolling in? You know, but anyway, just once I would like to see someone with nothing make something. Anyway, but acting, standout performances here. I from uh especially and I'm probably gonna mispronounce her name, but Inda Neverett is who played Nikki, who played Nikki, she was fantastic. Yeah, like I thought she was she was incredible. She uh even at the end when switching from like abject mourning and shock to just plain horrific shock, yeah, what was was fantastic. And listening to her wail as you're leaving the theater, yeah. Well done.

SPEAKER_01 13:30

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely well done. I think they took that clip of her wailing at the end and put it in the middle when he calls to try to take it back. I think that was the the screaming and wailing that they that they played there, which was really good.

SPEAKER_03 13:46

Well, it was weird because uh the when he walks into the uh the monkey paw store essentially, yeah. And uh is talking to all everyone's super awkward, he's awkward there like everyone in this fucking movie is awkward, and at first I'm like, well, it might just be a Gen Z thing, but then I'm like, oh, this it's a store of demons.

SPEAKER_01 14:06

Yeah, yeah. It puts you on edge.

SPEAKER_03 14:08

Everybody's weird and it puts you on edge. It was a store of demons. But um anyway, yeah. So but some of the yeah, her acting, especially. If I could rate this film on her acting alone, uh yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02 14:25

In the background, people are saying it, you gotta just kill yourself.

SPEAKER_03 14:30

Just fucking kill yourself, dude.

SPEAKER_02 14:31

It was really funny.

SPEAKER_03 14:33

Just fucking kill yourself.

SPEAKER_02 14:35

It was always suggested.

SPEAKER_03 14:37

Well, like and he he's one of those uh just perpetual nice guys uh that as you get older you learn that they're a lot of times the true villain. And I was cued into that immediately, yeah, just by the fact that he was a cat guy. Obviously not. You you can like whatever pet you want, but anyway, um, if it was her acting alone, shit, I I'd be talking 4.5 fives. Um but she did have to drag along a few people, and uh for that I'm gonna give the acting a four. Um cinematography, I thought was very competent, very well done in a lot of regards. Um, I like honestly, here what I want to believe about this is that I'm seeing work by a bunch of passionate people who are giving it their all because they don't have everything to fall back on. That's what I want to believe when I see this movie, and I'm hoping that's what it seems like. That's what it seems like. And and I thought it was fantastic. Yeah, me too. I thought a lot of the shots were were just great. Um I the the color uh use was fantastic. Shadows uh were incredibly well done. Oh yeah. Um just just some of her demonic movements, and I also appreciated that too. I hate it when you try and teach me something in horror and it's strictly metaphor and nothing's literal. Like, no, this is actually a demon fucking with him trying to teach through metaphor. And I I really enjoyed that. And the demon moves, the demonic movements and things like that were really good. There were times in a even I'm like, hey, stop fucking running at me, lady, I'm gonna fucking bust you.

SPEAKER_00 16:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 16:28

So cinematography, I I give this a 4.5 score. I am so sick of uh Stranger Things, Stephen King, 80s, nostalgia. Um, not fucking everything has to be playing out of a 1980s shopping mall. Uh that's getting old. It's getting fucking old. And um some of the some of the actual songs they used, like I get why you did it, but it's like if you I I could see me being in a car with you insufferable bunch of jackasses, and you start putting this shit on like I want to enjoy it through the road trip. Uh and so it was like some of that was kind of rough. I think there was better use of just screams and crying, actually, a lot of the times. Score, I'm gonna give it 2.5. Really? Yeah. I mean, this is a monkey's pie. It's a, you know, careful like we've seen this before, but it was very well done. It was very well done. And you know, and we'll go further into this on the golden path. I just hope that they intended the lessons that could be pulled out of this. But what's weird, just because it's um uh the audience that these guys seem to garner is very internet-based. I'm I'm curious if some of these things are gonna land. And honestly, I hope they do, because I feel like these lessons are shit that needs to be learned by a younger generation for sure. Like, and people make these like these are things like you gotta come to terms with a lot of this stuff here, and these are things that need to be learned early so you're not hurting people as an adult. Like this fucking prick. And um so, but plot, uh, it was good. Uh it was fun. It it definitely took me there and back again. Um, take definitely things that I didn't expect. Yeah, it took me up in a mordor, brought me back to the Shire, and then burnt the Shire down. So uh yeah. Plot uh I'm gonna give Plot I'm gonna give a four. Uh rewatchability. So it's a tough one.

SPEAKER_02 18:49

This might be the toughest score.

SPEAKER_03 18:52

That that is a tough one just because it is a hard watch, but I also like brutal. Like I I put on like I put on very hard watches in the background. They relax me, and I don't know why. Like I'm a guy who casually watches horrific things while I'm just you know, they calm me. And so I will definitely I will definitely watch it again. Um but like like my girlfriend and they they're not gonna want to watch this, so it's gonna be hard to watch it in normal company. So it's gonna be a situation where I'm alone and like it's time for another viewing of obsession. So I'm not gonna have a lot of opportunities too, but I do want to watch it again. Um, so I'm gonna give that a three.

SPEAKER_01 19:42

Okay. Three. All right, so your score averages out to a 3.5. Let's go ahead and move on to my scores. Pretty good. Pretty 3.5 is pretty good. Very strong. Uh, I was really impressed by this movie. I thought that

James’s Ratings And Horror Comparisons

SPEAKER_01 20:03

this was the best evil dead movie there that's ex that has existed.

SPEAKER_03 20:12

Like this was I I thought very similar because those demons are very evil dead like. And I appreciated that.

SPEAKER_01 20:21

Yeah, it's very interesting. One so we'll get to it. We'll get to it in the golden path. We'll get to it in the golden path. I just want to throw out there that I really liked this movie. I was I was deeply disturbed by this movie. I went to see this movie by myself. I didn't bring Shara. I I'm glad I I'm glad I did not bring Shara. I'm glad I saw this.

SPEAKER_03 20:42

I wish I I wish I followed your your yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:46

Okay, and um, yeah, deeply disturbing. Uh I had nightmares about this movie after I saw it.

SPEAKER_03 20:54

Um I mean I'm still sitting here kind of pondering it over. I we had I saw it this morning, and while I was waiting for the show, I'm like keep getting pulled, like I'm playing Stardew Valley just to chill out, and I keep getting pulled out of Stardew and raising my chickens to think about this fucking film.

SPEAKER_01 21:11

Yeah, the the fucking near the end where it's the the the corpse on the chair, like spread eagle naked with the busted head face. Um oh man. Uh yes, really super disturbing imagery. Really, I thought the acting in this movie was fantastic from our two leads. And uh I think that everybody else in the background, and you know, I didn't I didn't think about the people in the store, the demons. You know, I didn't think about them as demons. I thought that was very funny that you said that, but I didn't really think about them as demons. I realized I think about them as they're they're just they're just capitalists. They're just they're just wort they're just the agents of of selling, you know, buyer caveat emptor, buyer beware, you know. Yeah. Just the agents of selling, and it's like you you bought a thing, like you have agency, it's your money, you know. You bought this, dude. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But he read the terms. I I did think that the guy who um the guy who was behind the counter when he came back who was fucking with him was very funny. I thought that shit was hilarious. Uh, and I thought he that guy did a really good job, and when he's like, you know, the music starts to come on, and and his like he focuses, and you can just hear him kind of talking in the background. He's like, You can always kill yourself. And and like they a few a few different people did that when like his his focus was going to like you can always kill yourself.

SPEAKER_02 22:36

That should do it, you know.

SPEAKER_03 22:38

And that's how I knew they were demons. They they were obviously in on the cell.

SPEAKER_01 22:45

Uh, yeah, that's I like that a lot. And uh I thought the acting was really good. The the shitty friend was shitty. The um I I even liked the the waitress at the beginning was very funny once you learned she was a waitress and not the person he was talking to. Yeah, you got a good point. You got a good point, yeah. Yeah, there were a lot of really good actors. So I'm gonna give this I'm gonna give this a 4.5. This is about as close to a five as I've seen in a long time. I really liked the acting in this movie. Um, and I I feel like our two leads, him being an awkward, just also he'd get like like there is like this seething resentment and grief and like self-loathing uh from uh Cooper Todd. Oh no, no, uh, from Michael Johnston, who played Bear. And uh like even in that, his reluctance, his his like grip and inability to give up the thing that he uh has convinced himself he wanted, or you know, he still finds it salvageable. And um yeah, I thought it was really good. Uh so yeah, so 4.5 on acting, cinematography. I this this gave me I I felt like this the vibes of the filming of this were similar to something like uh It Follows for a lot of the filming and a lot of the shots, but in a way that things kept moving. Yeah, It Follows I really liked also, but it had it had a lot of It Follows had more long shots. It it felt like the close shots of It Follows where things feel like intimate intimately scary. And it didn't have those long shots or the or the like or stuff like that, but it it it felt like it felt like all the short shots of It Follows, which kept it like more, it kept the thing moving more. It kept the pace going. And I really liked that about the cinematography. And I agree about the about the like demonic movements. A lot of it, you could I could tell like thinking about it later, was it was a lot of reversed movements. Yes, it was a lot of it was it was her movements were rolled backward, and and that was the like the awkwardness of the movements, and I really enjoyed that. Um I felt like they they did it in a way that I feel is fairly fairly unique. I'm sure some people have done this kind of movement before in horror, but this is my first encounter with it, and and I'm I'm I think they did a great fucking job. And they did a lot of they live did I thought the props department was really good too. The props department, you know, whenever they take out a book or something, you know, they had they had um you could you could read the writing on it, and the props department paid attention. Yeah, really good. Uh so I'm gonna give the cinematography a 4.5 also. It's not like it's not it's not the best of the best, but it's I thought it was really good. Um, the score. When I think of score for horror movies, uh, you know, it's not just the music, it's the sound effects and it's the the transitions and stuff. And like I was saying about when when his mind starts to like focus in on something and everything gets kind of like silent and in the background. I consider that like part of the score and stuff, and uh, and the and the ways that they use that, they use that quite a bit and I I in an effective way, which impressed me. This was this was like the score and stuff is what Undertone should have been. Undertone could have used, could have could have done so much with the cinematography and score that this movie did. Oh, so many things were happening in the background of this movie. You were waiting for things in the background, and they paid off in this movie, and they never paid off in the podcast of Undertone one. That fucking that shit was garbage compared to this. This is like this is like a million times better than Undertone. Yes, agreed. So much better. Yeah, and I thought the score was good also. Uh I thought they used the uh ambience to such great effect. Uh so I'm gonna give it a four and score. Plot. The plot on this one, uh, it's so it's not like an it's not like an evil dead in in that evil dead nobody deserves it. You know, it's just a thing that happens and everybody fucking dies. Yeah, nobody deserves it. Yeah, nobody deserves anything. But this guy like made a choice, and I like it, it's it's fucked up because I don't believe in like moral determinism in life, but also movies aren't life. You know, I I see movies as a way to like communicate with an audience about things that are perceived, or or you're you're trying to convey a message, and if you just want to reflect life, okay. That's what documentaries are for and stuff. Uh and so like the the chaotic the chaotic destruction and inevitability of like a um evil dead, you know, uh it doesn't it doesn't totally resonate with me in when it comes to movies, even though I believe that's kind of like what life is really. Uh but I thought this this that is what I appreciate about Evil Dead. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 28:00

And I don't you just you got no choice, man. Sorry, demon found you.

SPEAKER_01 28:04

It's it's nothing to do with you, you know. It has nothing to do with you, dude. Yeah, but um, but this one did have something to do with him, and it was about you know, the the plot took really good twists and turns. You know, I didn't expect you, you know, man, that scene where he turns around and the door is duct taped shut. Duct taped, yes. I and then you hear her in the background like, oh, if you're having trouble getting out, you maybe you could just stay home.

SPEAKER_02 28:34

Maybe you should just stay stay home. That's yeah, I was like, oh fuck.

SPEAKER_01 28:39

I thought the the the ways that they used and took turns of like what it what obsession is. They like used all the parts of the animal in the plot, and it drove the plot forward as as there was this degradation uh into madness. And I thought the plot was it, it it it uses a bear, it uses an archetypal plot, but it went so much harder and farther and and and and took turns and shit instead of just being as basic as it could be. Uh and so that I'm gonna give it a four. Uh and rewatchability. I I want to re-watch this movie like I want to re-watch Hereditary, which is I want to have some nightmares. I want to watch this movie when I want to have nightmares. I think this movie is I think this movie is just as good as Hereditary, which is which is to me, which which is to me like possibly my favorite horror movie of the past decade or or of the 2000s, Hereditary is like my favorite horror movie, and so I'm gonna give this a four because I'm I'm 100% gonna watch this movie again. I'm gonna look forward to watching it again, and I'm gonna be fucking I'm gonna be so disturbed.

SPEAKER_03 30:14

Okay, I'm gonna be so disturbed. All right, so uh and I I just wanted before your analysis when you told me my 3.5, I'm like, in my head, I'm like, this does deserve more than a 3.5, but I must trust our rating system because it's never, it is never wrong. If you want to bump it up, you can.

SPEAKER_01 30:40

If you want to bump up your score as a code.

SPEAKER_03 30:43

What what uh what did it turn out to be?

SPEAKER_01 30:45

Uh turned out to be a four. Exactly. That is exactly where it should be. I uh yeah, I mean, yeah. I I would even go a little higher than four. My average came out to higher than four, but I trust that not everybody feels the exact same way I do about it.

SPEAKER_03 31:05

That is why, because this is a podcast for all, unless you're rich.

SPEAKER_01 31:10

Honestly, this movie is so close to a five for me. This movie is like so close to a five. It is it is there's something this movie has a genese qua about it. Yes. Uh that maybe cannot be calculated.

SPEAKER_03 31:26

Yes. I uh it is it's definitely it is definitely a fine film. It is a fine film. I yeah, I agreed, agreed. But yeah, I think uh I think uh I think 4.4 lands right in the middle of where audiences could take it. Because like if this isn't your thing and you're kind of afraid of this and you've had some issues with this and it's maybe too triggering.

SPEAKER_01 31:57

Some people walked out right at the end. My theater was packed, first off. My theater was packed with Gen Z, and some of them could not stop talking at the screen and and and making noises, just making mouth noises. And some people walked out right at the end because they just could not handle the ending of this movie, and I totally get it. I totally get it, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 32:23

Um yeah, but just with um and well, I mean, we're in the fucking golden path now, so let's let's line them up so we can just talk about it. So, welcome to the golden path. Let's talk about the deeper meanings of this film. And I I I think so like an and you know, obviously, this is this is coming from a millennial, so you

The Golden Path And Core Message

SPEAKER_03 32:51

gotta fucking take it with a grain of salt and cheers to being a millennial. Oh, cheers. I think that this movie is important for the newer generations and for Gen Z, especially in terms of what I see becoming important to this particular generation that has essentially red-pilled itself on social media and it's not itself.

SPEAKER_01 33:14

Our generation and those older than us have red pilled them. Like the people the the people who who control the levers of media have done it to them. And it's itself perpetuates after that point. It's like a virus.

SPEAKER_03 33:29

Yes. And I think this movie points out a virus that is propagating. And I I think it points out a I think a lot of people came into this movie relating to the main character and weren't ready to be called out, essentially. Right, yeah. And I I think which which I think i is a service. And like, hey, like, look, we have all been shitty young adults. Like, every one of us has been a shitty young adult. We like that's just the job of a young adult, is you're gonna be a shitty fucking person because that it's just the way it is. Our society sort of propagates it, like we're just talking about. You know, a lot of these these traits are a disease. I was a shitty young adult, you were a shitty young adult. And if you are relating to this main character, and you all of a sudden get offended, and you you know, like that, that's good. Let it offend and let it make you question. Ask some questions. Alright, like, is this who I want to be? Is this what I want to do? Is this how I want to treat people?

SPEAKER_01 34:46

What's fucked up is some of the questions online are like, you know, it explores the dark side of like being really into each other in a relationship. And I was like, wow, you really fucking missed the point, didn't you?

unknown 34:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:02

Which fucking miss. I don't know if I don't know if everybody's gonna learn a lesson from this. It'd be nice if people learned the lesson of this, but I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 35:11

They're not gonna no, they're you we know they're not going to. One thing I have learned from you know, my a life as long as mine is that um you can have experienced and learned a lesson, and then you can scream that lesson at the top of your lungs at a friend, a loved one, just fucking anybody, like, hey, dude, you do not have to suffer through this lesson. You can just listen to me, I swear to God. All I have learned.

SPEAKER_01 35:43

Shut up, you old bitch.

SPEAKER_03 35:45

All I have learned, all I have learned from impassing lessons onto people is that one day me and that person will have something to drink about where they say, I should have listened to you, man. And I'm like, Yeah, I I fucking know. Drink up.

unknown 36:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:06

Yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_03 36:07

That's all I've that's all I've learned from it. Um everyone has to learn their own lessons. The only thing that we learn as a human being is we get better at math and science and our technology becomes more dangerous.

SPEAKER_01 36:24

There are so there are well-adjusted people who learn lessons and stuff, but things have the problem the exactly, you have not met them because the world has continu like the the way that humans gather information has been so corrupted that it's not trustable and there is no source of truth anymore. Yes, and so learning lessons is difficult because you can't trust any source except what except what you perceive. It's how a lot of people feel, right? I'm not saying that's the truth, but I could certainly see how people feel that way. Yeah. And so, you know, that's something that probably we probably have to fix before people are start start trusting other people on lessons and shit. Yes. The lesson is you should give me all your money.

SPEAKER_03 37:22

Yeah, you know, well, and the problem here is that we we have too many people in power that they rely on you being misinformed. Um, I mean, even me, I I be at being a self-questioning individual, I will look at people in today's society who are just so fucking sure of their beliefs and go, like, am I did I miss the point? Am I not seeing something? Like, does he need a golden statue? Like, you know, it's like I I will like, you know, I'll be like, what the fuck am I missing? I am I dumb? And I'm like, no. Probably not.

SPEAKER_01 38:03

You know, the golden statue thing really won it to turns me on to a point that I and and and the whole conversation so far is something I wanted to talk about about this movie. Yes. And it's about manufactured reality. It's about it's about a reality that we manuf that we manufacture for ourselves. And it's something that Bear goes through. Okay. So he

Manufactured Reality And Consent Breakdown

SPEAKER_01 38:28

manufactured first off a reality where Nikki is like the his soulmate, right? Yeah. Even though, even but, but that is like immediately with any kind of like um, you know, uh looking into sorry, I'm like so jittery from the fucking coffee. Without any kind of if you like look at the situation for a little bit, you realize that she's not his soulmate because she doesn't, because she doesn't want to be with him. That's like one of the main things, right? You know, you know, that's like that's the thing that's keeping you apart, is that she doesn't want to be with you, bear. And and so, and that is ignored by his desire. And so his desire has him use like a tool in order to get what he wants, despite who Nikki actually is. So he manufactures this reality that now Nikki is truly his soulmate by ignoring by by overriding that part of her. It's a trans and we learn later in the movie that that's a transgression against her. And we feel that maybe he has ignorance at this point, right, about this transgression. And and um, and she like snaps back to reality several times and stuff. And then we get to the point where she comes to the door the day after that first night that they spend together, where she like freaks out and stuff, and he's like, it was really fucking weird. Uh, she comes to his door and and she says, I really loved this line. Uh uh he said, Um, she said, I I just want you to know that you know, I don't think you're taking advantage of me. And he was like, Oh, I I didn't think I was, I didn't say I was. And and then they have this back and forth where she's like, Oh, well, I just wanted to, you know, I just wanted to let you know that you know, I don't think you are. And he says, Oh, well, I, you know, I yeah, I I'm not, you know. And but he is. Yeah, that's the thing, is we know he is. And now that you say that about the demons and stuff, uh, the way the light was like reflected in her eyes. Yes, it's like her eyes were mirrors, and this was an opportunity for him to see himself.

SPEAKER_03 40:40

You know, no, this demon was picking on prey, is what was happening right there.

SPEAKER_01 40:45

An opportunity to confront it, and he does eventually later be like, you know, this isn't right, you know, this isn't right, but he keeps doing it. And then it's like like right after he's like, This isn't right, you know, he it shows him having sex with her. You know, he's like using her as a sex puppet uh because he doesn't want to give up. You know, he's transgressed. He he was ignorant at first, but learned, and then he still continued to transgress in this and and and and he tries to convince himself, he tries to keep this manufactured reality that she actually wants to be with him. And we learn that you know the real her is trapped inside or somewhere else. And I I I really think that was the the uh the and also it dips into the kill yourself stuff. He gets told to kill yourself by like three different people, he told he gets told he could kill himself by like three different people. They're clearly hunting for him, right? Right. And and he thinks about it a couple times before the very end.

SPEAKER_03 41:52

Well, but this so but there were there was one moment. Um I'm sorry, but just on your on your point, there was a there was a moment before the demon took over and she had her moment where I don't think you're taking advantage of me. Before he made the wish, she said to him, You have a you like me, now say it now. This is your chance. Yeah, this is your chance for this to be consensual.

SPEAKER_01 42:16

Yeah, and he was a coward, and he didn't he didn't want to be vulnerable, so he took advantage of someone else. And he and Bear is truly a perennial coward for the entire film.

SPEAKER_03 42:29

Yeah, he's totally he doesn't shoot himself either, he takes pills, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 42:36

Uh let's see, yeah, he's the ultimate coward all the way to the end. I have notes here. He can't tell her how he feels, he'd rather use magic to violate her autonomy than be vulnerable. He can't hold uh her accountable about her lies and and and have and break up, he can't break the relationship off. He even tries to back out of killing himself when it's time to be noble and save Nikki. Yeah, um, yeah. Uh so yeah, not great. And then uh moving on in the in the manufacturality, there was one specific scene where he wakes up in the middle of the night and she's doing some of her freaky demon stuff. Uh there's multiple times. I think there's like the second time where she brings a vase. Do you remember the vase? The vase scene? So so so what did you think about that? Because I have a very specific thought that relates to this. Did you have any thoughts about it, or do you just want me to go? I want you to go because I I'm very curious. So, do you know who Rene McGreet is? No. A painter. Renee Magreet was a painter. Um, and they were a like post war surrealist, or kind of like uh World War II uh era and post

The Vase Scene And Magritte

SPEAKER_01 43:47

war surrealist. And they did a bunch of paintings that were like about manipulating manipulations of reality. Uh one of them was this pen is not a pen, and it was like a painting or Or this pipe is not a pipe, and it was a painting of like a smoking pipe. Okay. And it was like and it was supposed to make you think like, okay, this is an image and a and a symbol of a pipe. It's not actually a pipe. It is a painting. Yes. This pipe is not a pipe. And he's a big thing. He also did a series of paintings where you're probably very familiar with this one a man in like a bowler hat who has an apple in front of his face. So that that painting is called uh the fifth season. And it is specifically a painting about manufactured and alternative reality, where you're placing a thing in front of a thing, making perceptions of what is behind it that you don't know the truth of or that you're unwilling to face the truth of. And so she's holding this beautiful vase of flowers in front of your face, and you don't know what's behind that at that moment.

SPEAKER_03 45:03

I love how cultured these demons are. Truly. Truly. They are not hunting people, they are critiquing art and film.

SPEAKER_01 45:14

And then she and and she's been yelling and screaming and being terrifying. And then she she takes it away and she's she's bubbly, right? Yeah. She puts it down. She's like, I was just getting flowers, you know, memorial for the cat. And and he's like, Oh shit. You know, it's that it's his inability to it's it's like this this manufactured reality that he keeps insisting on all the way to the end after she's stabbed herself in the fucking face, after she's killed his his two of his friends, you know. Yeah. And uh and then and then at the and then the and then when he starts to when it when it breaks down, right? When he when it gets gets to the point where he can't ignore it anymore, when Nikki kills Sarah, smashes her face just over and over on that brick in the car. Yeah. Uh uh she goes, This is really all your fault, is what she is what she says to him as she like curls up to him. This is really all your fault. Because the manufactured, like this is the breaking of the manufactured reality. It's so funny that he even slips back into it at the end. I love that in the end he tries to make him throw himself throw up the pills, yeah, but he can't do it because someone else takes control of him. Like he he loses his autonomy at the end, and he has no choice, and that's the only way that he breaks out of like this cowardly inability to face reality. Man, I thought this movie was so good.

SPEAKER_03 46:54

Yes, and I agree, I agree entirely. Yeah, and and I'll I will state if if someone puts a 4.5 on this thing, I'm like, yeah, it deserves it. Yeah. Yeah. Four is but before is the rating of the world, is what we give to the world. So fantastic film. But it is time now to insert ourselves into this movie. So how does it change now? I I could start this one. Sure, yeah, let's do it. So so for me, like I've the problem here is that I'm not gonna be in

Inserting Ourselves Into The Movie

SPEAKER_03 47:39

this situation to begin with. But if that that's the problem. From a very, very young age, I learned that if you feel something, say it with your chest.

SPEAKER_02 47:51

Right.

SPEAKER_03 47:52

And if they're not into it, well then I guess do something else and maybe look them around. You know, they're like there has been my life.

SPEAKER_01 48:04

If you say what you want and it doesn't work out, you move on. You have an opportunity to then move on to more things, better things, maybe. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 48:12

And they might come around. It has happened to me. I have said, Hey, this is how I feel. No, okay, well, I'm gonna see this person. Oh, now you care. Okay, and I have seen that occur. I have seen that, like, and but like say just so when she so how it changed immediately when she's like, Hey, this is your chance. If you feel away, you gotta tell me. I'm like, all right, yeah, I feel away. I feel away. Because us just not being friends and we can't figure out a way to come in between is better than me sitting in constant torture. I didn't even have the balls to talk about my dead pet with you because I am so like, holy shit, if I rolled into that bar after a pet of mine died, that's all we're fucking talking about. Yeah, you know, I would have said on the phone, I can't come, my pet died. My pet fucking died. Yeah, and I need to study. And if you guys are and if you guys like aren't there for me in this, I'm finding other fucking friends. Like uh animals are a huge thing to me, and a loss of one is monumental. And so that that's the first thing. If for some wild reason we get to this point where because look, I have been in positions where I've like, you know, like spirits out there, please let this girl be into me. Please. But it's n it's never been like take away your fucking free will. It's like I hope she's into me. That's what it is. And if I got to the point where I'm snapping bullshit that I found at a fucking esoteric shop, yeah, I'm still not gonna think that that's what it was. I'm gonna I think you have to snap the thing. Well, no, I guess you don't. Okay, you don't know well. So let's say I snap the thing. I snap the thing because like I'm so I am so into her for fun. I snap the thing. Please let her be into me. Please be fair.

SPEAKER_01 50:16

Both of the lead women, both of the women in this film who are like in the friend group are gorgeous.

SPEAKER_02 50:22

They're beyond gorgeous.

SPEAKER_03 50:26

But uh oh boy. So so yeah, maybe I snapped a thing beyond gorgeous. Andy Richter, please. Um I snap the thing. It's it's like to me, it'd be like a yuck. You know, like uh, please, please. I know, you know, but because of that, I wouldn't immediately think that my carrot did something. I would think that, you know, I'm I'm pretty fucking hot. She finally came around, like, whatever it is, but she is now obviously having a mental psychotic break. I am calling people. I am I am contacting the local um clinicians, hospitals, all those sorts of things. Hey, this this girl I'm seeing right now, she is going through something. We need professionals here immediately. Okay? I need a wellness check, stat. Um she needs help. All right. And if for some reason the powers of the story push it away, like they did like that. Was like a thing that confused me. Like, I don't know why they he did go to the hospital and they're like, no, no. If they did that to me and I realized, like he eventually realizes that it's not her, that it's a demon. Right. I'm gonna match this demon's freak.

SPEAKER_00 51:49

Well, that's eventually what what happens at the end. Oh, no, right before he dies.

SPEAKER_03 51:54

Well, that's because a demon took him.

SPEAKER_00 51:56

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 51:58

Me as a human, I'm like, oh, okay, it's not you. It's it's an entity that's fucking with me. I'm like, okay, okay, okay, you want to take me in? All right. And I'm gonna match this demon's freak. I'm like, get on your fucking knees. I'm gonna show you. No, you look at me like you like it. Um, I'm I am going to exercise this demon with taking this demon's freak and maximizing it. I will show this demon. Like, hey, oh, you want to play with me, do you? Welcome to Fifty Shades of Grey uh times a thousand. All right. Um, I'm gonna make you uncomfortable. You want to play with me in the dark? I'm gonna play with you in the dark. Like the demon gets up to fuck with me in the middle of the night. I'm already in the same corner. Like, hey, what were we about to do? Oh, that sounds sexy.

SPEAKER_01 52:50

Get on your waiting, you're waiting for it in the corner.

SPEAKER_03 52:53

Yeah. Oh, oh, what were you about to do? That sounds sexy. Get on your knees. I got something. Where are you going? Bitch, I'm going wherever the fuck I want. No, you ain't. No, get back here. You want to play this? Um, and and that's what I'm gonna do. Because, like, for me, just suicide isn't an option. I just don't have it in me. Um, and if I can't get authorities here to help with a mental health crisis, if I can't and if I know that there is an entity trying to take me out, well then you uh you fucked with the wrong dude, and uh I'm gonna take this demon ass for all it's worth. And that that's what I'm gonna do. So but all of those things is why I wouldn't be there in the first place.

SPEAKER_01 53:40

Very good. Your turn. So for me personally, I'm a real I'm a real wife guy. And it seemed like the demon's biggest pet demon. I'm a real wife guy. I'm always whenever I'm in a relationship with someone, that's who I spend most of the vast majority of my time with anyway. I don't need to leave the house to go do all that other stuff. Yeah, actually, uh pretty uh uh the demon's biggest complaint seemed to be that uh that uh Bear didn't love her as much as as she loved him. I'll love that demon a lot. You know, uh I'll I'll just I'll sate the demon with constant attention.

SPEAKER_02 54:25

Like he was uh he was like pointing her face toward like the scene when he was like pointing her face toward the television to make because he wanted to want no, I'll make out the demon, we'll we'll fuck all day.

SPEAKER_01 54:36

Like when I uh when I when I first ended up with Sarah, we we ended up fucking for like 12 hours one day when we first got together. We fucked like all day long, and I yeah, yeah, no problem.

SPEAKER_02 54:53

I I'll keep doing it.

SPEAKER_01 54:54

Line it up my demon would have no complaints. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 55:01

If I snapped it.

SPEAKER_03 55:03

Well, so I think in both both instances you have a demon who's like going back to the office, you know, in those moments where they're you know, away going like I s I uh I think uh I think this is the one.

SPEAKER_00 55:20

I don't know how none of the classic stuff is doing it.

SPEAKER_03 55:23

Nothing, yeah, and I have I have come more than I have ever. He yeah, uh so like I I think we would both give this demon something it was missing.

SPEAKER_01 55:38

You know, and but obviously the the real answer is like after I realized, you know, that yeah, because certainly as I was when I was younger, I I did not have a good understanding of consent because my consent had been violated in so many ways before that that I didn't have a strong foundation for it. And so after I realized that I had violated someone's autonomy, I would like do everything to undo it like immediately that first night. I wouldn't have any there would be no going back after that first night. No, it'd be a wrap going back over and over again was like I thought was really a really really good part of that movie. I wouldn't be going back. I would figure we'd be figuring out a way to to to fix this way sooner. Like the next day, I'd be like, whoa, whoa, whoa.

SPEAKER_03 56:28

Yeah, hold on a minute. Yeah, no, and and again, I think that comes back to that this movie is important for younger audiences. Um this is like you need to understand you can't some things you can't take back.

SPEAKER_01 56:43

That doesn't mean you have to fucking double down and until you until you kill yourself, and also killing himself didn't really solve things, you know.

SPEAKER_03 56:53

No, now that woman has to live with the consequences of your actions. Yep, killing himself didn't really solve things. No, yeah, so well, and I I will say my my constant battle with where these movies are coming from. I I I will say, Curry Barker, I don't know where you're coming from. I'm scared that you guys have some sort of insider in. I will for right now, because you're obviously you're about to make more stuff. You you don't put out a movie like this. Yeah, there's a lot of talent here. And so what I'm gonna look at is I'm gonna look at talent. I'm gonna look at the importance of this message, and I'm gonna uh I'm gonna stop worrying that this is coming from a place of privilege. And because I I think, yeah, this is this is an important message, especially to you know to the folks that are coming up right now. If if you're reaching the point where you're 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, and you're still 51, 52, 52. And you're still resonating with this this guy, and the things that

The Lesson: Autonomy And Accountability

SPEAKER_03 58:04

he experiences and learns causes a dissonance in you, you need to take a serious look at what your thoughts of consent are.

SPEAKER_01 58:13

What what it me what what you actually like about a person. If you if you if you think that a person should be with you and you would use this tool or whatever, think about what autonomy means. Think about what you actually like about a person, because what he really liked about her was he wanted to use her as a fuck toy. That's what he wanted from her, was for her to be his pretty fuck toy. And he didn't really like anything about her. All the things he was listing at the beginning, the the friends like Nikki hates that shit. She wouldn't like any of that. Yes, you know, he didn't he didn't want any of that. What he wanted was to fuck her. Yeah. And if that's all you want from a person, you don't really like that person. And and if you and what this was was rape. Obviously, we've talked we've we've kind of talked around it a lot, but this was a rape allegory.

SPEAKER_03 59:06

You know, yeah. So yeah. And look, if that makes you uncomfortable, that's fine. Look at it, don't shy away, don't double down. Yeah. All right. This is not just your life.

SPEAKER_01 59:20

This is the character moved from ignorance. He was ignorant about the situation, and he did the thing and he couldn't take it back. But then you but then you try to fix the situation, you don't make it worse, you don't ignore it, you don't further transgress, you don't try, you don't do things to protect your ego defensively. You try to solve the problem because you created a problem with your ignorance. Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 59:46

Exactly. And honestly, the best thing to come out of obsession is a particularly powerful episode of High and Dry Podcast.

SPEAKER_00 59:54

Yeah. I'm your host, Ryan Baron North. This episode is not an episode.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:00

It's a lesson. With me as always, James Croslin. Uh yeah. Check yourself before

Final Takeaways And Sign-Off

SPEAKER_03 1:00:09

you wreck everyone else.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:10

You can only just kill yourself.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:12

You can only just kill yourself.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:13

Don't do it, don't, don't do it.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:15

Bye.